Although I think the assumption is you would have your 5 ton gravity battery already charged/lifted so it was ready to go in an emergency. One of the most interesting aspects of this technology, especially nowadays, where the unstable international geopolitical situation has generated several problems related to the supply of materials, is its composition. http://bit.ly/3XmpvNP. Figure 1: In this liquid metal battery, the negative electrode (top) is a low-density metal called here Metal A; the positive electrode (bottom) is a higher-density metal called Metal B; and the electrolyte between them is a molten salt. 'Significant breakthrough': This new sea salt battery has 4 times the The main difference between saltwater batteries and other energy storage options (for example, lithium-ion and lead-acid batteries) is their chemistry. Actually this is a much bigger deal for missiles than nuclear warheads. When the battery is discharged to zero, at which point it will start to cool down and will not be able to wotk after another warm-up phase. In order to safeguard our and our planets health, a radical change in thinking and shared action is absolutely essential, but it is also important to clarify the technologies available today that are truly effective, without falling into the traps generated by false information. So the plant would generate electricity on demand, and store excess energy in the form of two molten salts; and at night it would combine them to continue producing energy until the next day (and to keep the salts in the molten state). A team of scientists have shattered the record for the amount of energy produced during a controlled, sustained fusion reaction. In the Mediaset report, in fact, salt batteries are portrayed as an ideal solution for electrification: high-performance, ecological, safe, almost eternal batteries But where is the catch? So: Buy, when heat is low price, and store in thermal storage to use when needed. With the Stirling engine the only control you have at all (at least in all the versions Ive ever seen) is the heat input. Once you start getting into really small scale battery start to look much much better as long as they are inside the area they are heating, as generally battery dont like cold. I want to use the North wall as a heat the water (or other liquid (???)) MIT discovery resurrects potential of molten salt batteries for grid The pool will not boil but you delta T to boil just got small. It is true, the technology behind molten salt batteries has never broken through, but like any respectable energy source, it has its pros and cons and is more or less effective depending on the area of application. 50 to 100 kWh Molten Salt battery? - DIY Solar Power Forum Aluminum-nickel molten salt battery for seasonal renewables storage There are an increasing number of solutions available in the field of energy storage, but not all of them are yet efficient. What happens if the battery pack cools down? I grew up in Barstow and I dont remember such a plant being in the area. Caption. But now some places do infact run regen systems with little or no counterweight as its possible. Salt batteries: pros and cons of a 40-year-old innovation - Flash Battery INTRODUCING THE molten salt nuclear battery 100.000,00 i.v. When the metal is produced using evaporation ponds, for example, it takes approximately 2.2 million litres to produce one metric tonne. DIY Molten salt battery - YouTube That one is operating again. when its remaining capacity falls below 80%, it will still have numerous possibilities for use in other areas, one of which is energy storage, for powering the utilities of homes and buildings. http://physics.ucsd.edu/do-the-math/2011/11/pump-up-the-storage/. Adding water to sand woudnt the water boil away wasting energy and the sand never reaching 10x of water if you keep on adding water. Put the sand in a bucket on a cable connected to a motor/generator and you have a gravity battery. That solution is the "electrolyte," and in PNNL's battery, it's made of molten salt. Hes got a lot of potential to entertain and so on but unless the viewer is somewhat literate in physics and can see through it, that guy is setting unrealistic expectations and sells his stuff like that. Don Sadoways group over at MIT is researching liquid electrolyte batteries with many of the same characteristics. The lithium compound, however, is slightly toxic (even though it was briefly sold as a salt substitute, also). A Stirling engine could probably work with hot water, but since they were never widely adopted, Im assuming there was some kind of inefficiency in using them that Im not familiar with. A generator with an open circuit becomes essentially a tachometer. mmm.. interesting. How it works: Batteries contain two electrodes (the cathode and the anode) and a solution that carries charged atoms (ions) between them. Lithium batteries are also not to be regarded as unsafe. WHY THE FLASH BATTERY LITHIUM BATTERIES ARE A DIFFERENT BREED FROM THE COMPETITION ONES, SUBSCRIBE TO THE NEWSLETTER TO RECEIVE NEW ARTICLES AND FLASH BATTERY INSIGHTS, Source Fig. However for renewables, the case of having more energy than needed and not being able to store the energy source (sunlight, wind) is quite common. BTW nuclear warheads are still not completely sealed because they often use Tritium and that has a pretty short half life and decays to He3 which is a fission poison. Just as in this video- putting the working into showing it works, but a *Peltier* junction for energy extraction? His hope isnt to store a couple days of energy for an off-grid survivalists house. or just use the energy when the grid isnt in demand to pump water back up a hydro rig into a big dam. Concrete food laid (capping the sand battery). A military tech you probably heard about, but couldn't find any details on. That said I dont know how small your could start small would really be, I understand much of Canda gets really damn cold for a prolonged period so you may well be thinking big enough to become really practical in the real world. A paper published in Nature magazine describes a new battery type that uses aluminum and sulfur as the main components. I thought the battery advance was what was required to make a sealed pit weapon, but it turns out they were two separate advances, both required in order to be able to keep the warhead itself permanently shut. joeborrello has added PLANKuter to To Do. You do understand that were facing a totally unprecedented technical challenge the size we havent seen since the industrial revolution, and we dont have the advantage of untapped natural resources on the material side of it? Scientists altered the electrodes to improve the reactivity of the sulphur - a key element determining storage capacity. August 24, 2022 Press Inquiries Caption The three primary constituents of the battery are aluminum (left), sulfur (center), and rock salt crystals (right). Well, maybe if people werent playing so much Candy Crush we wouldnt need as much power! The future of energy will undoubtedly be renewable, and we are all moving towards sustainable choices, but we must bear in mind that there are no technologies that are simply miraculous: each one has positive and negative aspects and it is up to us to inform ourselves as best we can, weighing up the merits, shortcomings, limitations and opportunities, and clearly assessing the goals we want to achieve. Lithium extraction can result in water shortages, biodiversity loss, damage to ecosystem functions and soil degradation. 5: Best conditions of use for salt batteries (2 to 10 hours of back up) . El Nio is back: How will it affect global weather in 2023? In winter, however, when production is low, it must still be understood that there will be a constant loss of energy to keep it going. Basically are molten salt at room temperature. I used slightly different words in my other comment but what you say is exactly the same. US scientists have developed a battery that can retain 92% of its initial capacity over periods of 12 weeks, with a theoretical . Self-discharge is not intrinsic to the cell itself, but depends on the thermal insulation used. Whereas a traditional lithium-ion battery uses the element lithium as its . Let us look in detail at the advantages and disadvantages of salt batteries. In terms of entertaining people looking out for experimentation hes got very good ideas and can bring it in a very understandable manner. He was too deep into it to stop it. Where is this plant located? If you are not talking about population control, you havent got anything to contribute. By using our website and services, you expressly agree to the placement of our performance, functionality and advertising cookies. Give them one to evaluate, come back in a year to see if theyve drifted away from it, or if it still suits them, Old idea. Long-term battery storage would make our existing energy grids more reliable. Salt batteries consume a lot of energy and should be left permanently attached to the charging post to keep them in operation. The researchers now plan to improve and commercialise the new cells. Development of these batteries solved a critical issue with nuclear weapons. Its not like you can only use a dam once, then throw it away. My New English Channel - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCNJBDc9l_I59-nFvXQMF31QAny one can make this at home.Here, Copper Plate or rod is positive. Do you mean the plant in Nevada? Aluminum-nickel molten salt battery for seasonal renewables storage. And where would you have such a big dam? Overall, only about a fifth of the energy we use is in the form of electricity, and despite efforts in efficiency and cutting off waste, the transition towards renewable energy will have to see electricity consumption increase not decrease. https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-61996520. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. Yeah, unfortunately hes not too far away from a scam artist. galstaf Jan 10, 2023 1 2 Bluedog225 Texas Joined Nov 18, 2019 Messages 2,060 May 18, 2023 #21 The website is not good. The heat can later be converted into superheated steam to power conventional steam turbines and generate . so how can their energy be fully exploited? they require a very high constant temperature, it takes between 10.5 and 11 hours just to reach the melting temperature that allows the battery to function, that in 24 hours, the battery will use 30 per cent of its energy just to keep itself operational. Previously they had to be left open so that a fresh cell battery could be inserted and sealed prior to being loaded onto a plane; batteries at the time had such short shelf lives the weapons couldnt be manufactured with them included. I think someone should start a multilevel solar panel company in which the solar panels are rent to own at a price lower then standard utility. Credits Image: Rebecca Miller In one of the longer MIT videos, he mentions that once up to temperature and in either a state of charge or discharge, a fair amount of heat is generated by the ion movement, sufficient that with decent insulation the battery will maintain its molten state on its own. What Is a Molten Salt Battery? - Homeowner In addition, lithium batteries are available in numerous chemistries and utilise different elements and compositions to suit a wide variety of usage situations. INTRODUCING THE molten salt nuclear battery 52 Nuclear News June 2021 INTRODUCING THE molten salt nuclear battery Molten salt reactor technology first gained popularity in the 1960s, through the Molten Salt Reactor Experiment program at Oak Ridge National Laboratory. Storage solutions that are manufactured using plentiful resources like sodium which can be processed from sea water also have the potential to guarantee greater energy security more broadly and allow more countries to join the shift towards decarbonisation.. This will have coiled tubing throughout its length. Ordinary household energy consumption is between 20-50% electricity, and nearly all of the rest comes from natural gas and fuel oil used for hot water, cooking, space heating. A new molten salt battery architecture offers a lower cost means, relative to available batteries of this type, for storing electricity generated by renewable energy sources at grid scale. Now, in most cases (fossil fuels and nuclear), that energy thats available and not being used is actually stored in a more useful form than hot sand. I have 2 port valves for heating and water cylinder. The Molten Salt Reactor (MSR) program was eventually developed, and the Molten Salt Reactor Experiment (MSRE) began construction in 1960 (Kelleher, 2015).The MSRE consisted of a primary loop of LiF-BeF2-ZrF4-UF4 (61.0:29.1:5.0:0.9 mol %), and a secondary loop of LiF-BeF2 (66:34 mol %) (Kelleher, 2015).The reactor core was a multi-channel graphite structure, through which the salt flowed and . The excavated dirt would be used on the sides of the pond both raising it above grade and insulating it. Would tell you to use the shortest lowest pitch blades possible for highest voltage. Molten salt batteries still account for a majority of installations by energy capacity, because of NGK Insulators' early lead, but are no longer the technology of choice, according to Lux. But without a great deal more detail on the plan and no real understanding of the demands on the system hard to really give any good answer. Solar scammers. So, even in a fairly large grid that consists of a high portion of these renewable sources, during a regular day one can expect to either have a severe power shortfall or a massive glut of overproduction, because the chances that you get just enough power to power everything is practically nil, and the situation can change in a matter of two hours. The pit is where the physics takes place at least, initially. Thats an important contribution. C.C.I.A. Potassium chloride is used as a salt substitute, so it isnt dangerous to handle (at least, no more dangerous than anything else heated to 400 degrees Celsius). In fact, we see that in 80 hours, the SOC reaches zero, which means that in 24 hours, the battery will use 30 per cent of its energy just to keep itself operational (thus, in a 9.6 kWh battery pack, 3 kWh per day will be wasted just to keep the battery at temperature). From my reading these heat store systems in the real world do follow the expected math rather well, and so work rather better at larger scales than small, and once you get small enough in practical terms it becomes rather less useful (the internal volume vs surface area to loose heat, the lack of thermal mass to volume taken up as you need so much insulation etc). Obviously, however, the more you isolate it by limiting heat dissipation in the environment, the more it will become untolerant of intense work phases, in which energy is also generated by its internal resistance, at which point it will no longer be able to dissipate heat, becoming overheated. Not that Id advise anybody to actually try to build one of those now. US scientists have developed a battery that can retain 92% of its initial capacity over periods of 12 weeks, with a theoretical energy density of 260 W/hour per kg. The more immediate impact of long-term battery storage would be to make our existing energy grids more reliable if severe weather disrupted power generation, we could tap into the energy of charged batteries while waiting for repairs. We talked about it in episode 45 of Battery Weekly 2022, our weekly column on the world of batteries, where our electrification experts Marco Righi, Alan Pastorelli and Daniele Invernizzi shed some light on this much-discussed technology, recounting its origins, uses, advantages and, above all, its many limitations. The simplest idea for storage charging up batteries at night when there is a lot of wind energy and not much demand for it, or at midday when the sun is bright is years from being feasible,. That based on chloride, move chloride ion between two metals, one more electropositive than other. I suspect that the choice of hot sand rather than hot water comes down to being able to store energy at a higher temperature (which allows for more efficient and/or different uses) more safely. Whats new? A DIY Molten salt battery - orbides.org dump it into the hot water heater. But renewables are not always as consistent as other sources meaning batteries are needed to store this electricity for later use. perfect, now lets put water and sand together to get things up and running. Both of these places are spearheading the renewable future, when in actuality theyre just shifting loads off the electric grid and powering them directly with fossil fuels because its becoming too costly otherwise. Gravis liked Open Sourcing the Design for the Quetzal-1 CubeSat. To be fair, she was storing shoes in the closets until she decided engineering was easy. Given the long warm-up times, it is obvious why this technology has never been extended for vehicle use. My idea is to dig 2 ft deep install concrete wall footers then dig an additional 3 ft deep inside the footer. Here we analyse how it works, and the pros and cons. Thats the power of a molten salt battery. Thanks!Subscribe To The Tesla Domain https://bit.. Although he didnt get the amount of power youd find in a commercial design, it did provide 1.6V and enough power to light an LED. Herein, we present an advanced Ni/NiCl 2-graphite battery (named as Ni-graphite battery) based on graphite cathode and Ni/NiCl 2 anode. Has anyone built a sand battery that can either heat or power a home? But you can heat the sand to 5x higher temp. In the graph, it is evident that the charging phase only begins when the internal temperature reaches 270C. However, that is only part of the story. By using our website and services, you expressly agree to the placement of our performance, functionality and advertising cookies. In consideration of the outstanding electrochemical reversibility of the Ni/NiCl 2 redox in ZEBRA battery and the adjustable melting point of the quaternary molten salts electrolyte in aluminum ion battery. This compares to pump-hydro (one of the most efficient competitors) at about 60% and hydraulic hydro at about 40%. As I said in the Minecraft coal-fired thermoelectric generator article comments, the TEG is INCREDIBLY hard to get working well. Progress! If a Sterling engine can run as a pump to heat the sand at better efficiency than resistive heat, thats a win. Could someone ELI5 now this works? The greenhouse is A 20 ft wide and 80 ft long poly tunnel. In pictures: South America's 'lithium fields' reveal the dark side of our electric future, France's massive new lithium mine could supply 700,000 electric car batteries a year, Good eggs: Eggs can be used to filter microplastics and salt out of water, research finds. Please be kind and respectful to help make the comments section excellent. It is, in fact, a well-established technology, at a time in history very similar to the one we are experiencing today, when oil prices skyrocketed and led to a real energy crisis where more and more researchers worked to find alternative solutions. It leaves the issue of the water boiling in the pipe if the sand is over 100C. (Comment Policy). Like F on assignment in middle school. Theyre counterweighted, so the motor only has to lift/lower the weight of the people in the car (plus overcome friction in the system). Any suggestions? Once the salt melts (usually from a pyrotechnic charge), the battery can produce a lot of energy for a relatively. DIY Molten salt battery Theartlav 5.1K subscribers Subscribe 690 71K views 7 years ago Molten salt battery. What is sun blocking and does it really work? The chemistry promises to offer a cheap solution and a significant . 4 ft wall block wall will then be built and a 4 in. Or are just using it to shift load/supply peaks a small amount for instance if there is a huge renewable peak and every tall building in the area has elevator that can regen on the way down you might as well drag them all the way up a few hundred, maybe few thousand elevators up potentially a few hundred meters, but probably more like 30 meter adds up hugely. Its also financially costly to mine at scale. ChadIsRad liked sPot: Spotify in a 4th-gen iPod (2004). While most media is fueled by toxic politics and negativity, we focus on solutions: the smartest people, the biggest ideas, and the most ground breaking technology shaping our future. Ice or Molten Salt, Not Batteries, to Store Energy The graph above shows what happens when you disconnect the battery from the charger and leave it standing: the internal BMS will use the stored energy to keep itself at operating temperature, but in doing so it will self-consume its own energy. Give her credit for going outside her comfort zone, dont break her spirit. This makes it possible to improve the operation of electricity grids and, at the same time, make greater use of energy from renewable plants. And since the charge is stored in the form of physically stable ions, yes it will hold a charge for a long time when cold. Figure 15. Any inefficiencies go into keeping the electrodes and electrolytes molten, and good thermal insulation isnt hard to build. Molten-salt battery - Wikipedia The sodium chloride used must be molten for it to work, which is why the temperature must be kept so high: the salt battery, in fact, only works when the salt is molten and this, like many other salts, melts at extremely high temperatures of 200 to 300 degrees: these are precisely the internal working temperatures of these batteries. Molten salt batteries are therefore not suitable for use in the automotive or industrial vehicle segments, which require fast recharging, high discharge power and the possibility of prolonged shutdowns without, however, losing autonomy. Batteries can help with short-term storage leveling out fluctuations in sunlight or wind over the course of the day or a week. Overall, capacity recovery is more than 90% after a period of 1-8 weeks. Didnt they use Lithium-6 to generate tritium directly on fission time? Overall, such batteries are composed of aluminum foil as the anode and various types of carbonaceous and organic substances as the cathode, which are immersed in an aluminum electrolyte that. The US electrical power generation is about 500 GW at any given time, give or take depending on the time of day, which means theres a need for 12 TWh of batteries to have one single day of buffer between the source and the load and mind you, we might get a week-long lull in output very easily: 14% deficit over 7 days is the same as one full day with no output, so without the batteries its back to shoveling coal. Aluminum-nickel molten salt battery for seasonal renewables storage Except that they are not changing. We are certainly talking about a technology with potential, but if it has not developped into large-scale production in all these years, it is surely also because of the various application limitations. So if you subtract that amount of energy from the equation doesnt sand win and the water boil off and the sand still remains so now you have the added expence of piping in water.Seams like water is pretty unsustainable because its finite only so much water. I have read a few things about these batteries being made out of low cost ingredients, but has anyone made one with relatively basic components like fire bricks, chimney insulation heating element to keep at temperature If youre going to store energy as heat (or just plain want to store heat), why not use a phase change material? A New Molten Salt Battery Promises To Outperform Li-Ion in Every Way It is still only going to be stored for a short time, maybe helps carry that reliable evening breeze and sunshine energy on towards morning, but its still energy stored effectively at no cost. It doesnt boil or require a pressure vessel and is self insulating if properly made. Many researchers are working on that and they could change the world of batteries. so what about using a solar panel to heat the sand have a hot water coil in that to pre-heat your domestic hot water before it goes to Hot water heart ( oild fired or electric ) would this make it more efficient would that make a difference if the water going in lets say 42 degrees and you can even raise it to lets say to 60- 65 degrees would this not be a solution as they always say a 1/3 of our energy goes to heat domestic hot water ?? The battery is discharged and the car no longer starts. Everyone agrees, our future will be driven by renewable energy, such as wind and solar power, but we must be careful: we are talking about intermittent renewable sources, as they derive from natural flows that are not always available and often difficult to control. But this new battery is different. Molten-Salt Battery Freezes Energy Over a Whole Season Then directly use hot water. Some rechargeable batteries can lose almost a third of their stored charge in a single month. Im here looking for help designing a scalable sand heat store for heat pump or bio-char kiln input and hot air recovery later. Lifts dont work like that, though. yeah but Molten salt batteries have two main advantages. What am I doing? Water can only be heated to 100C, Sand be used 10x hotter, so you can easily make up for this. This `heat nugget would store heat both from the specific heat as well as the latent heat of water. Michal has updated the project titled NEDbook.
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